A - I n f o s
a multi-lingual news service by, for, and about anarchists **

News in all languages
Last 30 posts (Homepage) Last two weeks' posts

The last 100 posts, according to language
Castellano_ Català_ Deutsch_ English_ Français_ Italiano_ Português_ Russkyi_ Suomi_ Svenska_ Türkçe_ All_other_languages
{Info on A-Infos}

(en) Some more stories from Indymedia

From Joe Black <revolt.news@usa.net>
Date Mon, 23 Jul 2001 16:13:48 -0400 (EDT)


 ________________________________________________
      A - I N F O S  N E W S  S E R V I C E
            http://www.ainfos.ca/
 ________________________________________________

Some more stories from Indymedia

1. Sir Bob Geldof and Carlo Giuliani
2. imc raid ...personal reflections =


---

Sir Bob Geldof and Carlo Giuliani

 by Joe 9:16pm Sun Jul 22 '01 (Modified on =

12:49am Mon Jul 23 '01) =


 Two types of protest movement =


 Sir Bob Geldof and Carlo Giuliani =


 The embrace between Irish pop millionaires Sir =

Bob Geldof and Bono with G8 leaders Tony Blair =

and Vladimir Putin in Genoa on Saturday evening =

shows that there are deep political divisions =

between those protesting the G8. I watched Sir =

Bob stand beside Putin, whose forces have killed =

tens of thousands in Chechnya, and condemn the =

=91violence=92 of the demonstrators. I watched Bono =

assure us that negotiation was the way forward =

despite the fact that only around 1% of the =

(inadequate) debt relief promised at the G8 =

summit of Cologne in 1999 has even surfaced. =


 There were two types of protest movement in =

Genoa. The first is that represented on the TV =

by important people like Sir Bob. They are =

interested in dialogue with the world=92s leaders =

and believe significant reforms can be won this =

way. What they wanted from the mass protests was =

a well-behaved stage army that would demonstrate =

that they had popular support. =


 The leaders of that movement believe that =

capitalism can become =91capitalism with a human =

face=92 if the politicians can be convinced this =

is the way forward. This they believe can happen =

through a process of patient explanation backed =

up by winning public opinion to the reform =

project. Because this is their approach =

repeatability and control of the forces they =

mobilise are high on their agenda. =


 The second type of protest movement is that =

represented by the image of Carlo Giuliani, shot =

by the police and then run over. He wasn=92t part =

of the well-behaved stage army. He was shot in =

the head while wearing a balaclava and attacking =

a police vehicle. This second type of =

demonstrator sees capitalism and the state as =

the problem. They don=92t see reform as an option =

and they don=92t want to be part of anybody=92s =

stage army. As far as they are concerned, and I =

agree, we need to abolish not just the G8 and =

WTO but also the capitalist system that gives =

birth to them. In Genoa the police built a 6-
metre wall to prevent any of these people =

=91embracing=92 Putin or any of the other G8 =

leaders. =


 This second group see no point in dialoguing =

with those whose job it is to ensure the =

continued existence of this system. To do so is =

just to give these world leaders legitimacy, to =

suggest that they are interested in something =

other then ensuring the continued rule of =

capital over people. Bono and Sir Bob did just =

this in meeting Putin and Blair. But they got =

nothing in return; no additional debt relief =

emerged from the summit. =


 Carlo is one famous name we now have for those =

who choose to fight to abolish capitalism. We =

have his name because he was murdered on the =

streets by the state forces. But for the most =

part this second group has no famous names, =

because we choose not to. We desire to do away =

with division between leaders and led that is so =

precious to Blair and Bono. We identify the =

mainstream media as of the problem rather then =

part of the solution. =


 This is not to claim that all those who stand =

for the abolition of capitalism are a united =

body either in terms of objectives or tactics. A =

wide gulf separates anarchist like Carlo from =

the various Leninist outfits who dream of a =

future where their party is in charge. We don=92t =

want the Leninist State with a Leninist police =

to make sure we follow the party line any more =

then we want the capitalist state. =


 But even within the anarchist movement there =

are divisions over tactics. Some, like myself, =

felt that in Genoa we should avoid property =

damage and concentrate on trying to break into =

the red zone. Others felt that this was fighting =

on the terrain defined by the police and instead =

property damage directed at banks and =

multinationals on the edges of the exclusion =

area could be used to fight on terrain of our =

choosing. =


 In the aftermath of Genoa there is a lot of =

quite bitter debate between people who identify =

with these different movements and all those who =

have a position between them. To those who value =

respectability and control the =91black block=92 can =

only be some evil police plot to discredit them =

in the eyes of =91public opinion=92. To those who =

see confrontation as essential to building a =

movement capable of defeating capitalism and the =

state these accusations demonstrate the hopeless =

liberalism of the reformists. =


 This is not a debate that will be settled one =

way or the other in the near future. What is =

more unless it is conducted in honest terms it =

will just create bitterness and hostility within =

the movement as a whole. In particular =91cop =

bating=92 (accusing others of being police agents =

without solid evidence) will only make the =

situation worse rather then better. =


 There were problems in Genoa because there was =

a real failure to create in advance an =

understanding that both sets of tactics would be =

used. Instead the Genoa Social Forum made =

promises that it could not keep that the =

demonstrations would be non-confrontational. As =

there was no clear attempt to set zones for =

different types of tactic in advance of the =

demonstration then inevitably reformist =

pacifists and revolutionary =91black block=92 =

protesters found themselves in the same areas. =

So now both sides accuse the other of sabotaging =

=91their=92 protest and manufacture conspiracy =

theories as to why this was so. The Italian =

police who so clearly enjoyed battering anyone =

from any sided they caught must be getting a =

great laugh out of this =96 and of course perhaps =

they have a few agents who are encouraging it!

----

imc raid ...personal reflections =


 by anti-capitalist 4:09pm Mon Jul 23 '01 =

(Modified on 5:05pm Mon Jul 23 '01) anti-
capitalist@anarcho.zzn.com =


 a bit of what i saw the past couple of days =


 Things are beginning to get back to normal, =

whatever that means. Here's a look at the last =

few days from what I've seen and heard. =


 Just after uploading my last report about the =

aftermath of the riot on Saturday, the yells =

started coming from within the IMC. =

=2E..'CARIBINERI are here!' Everyone was =

scrambling to close windows and get there gear =

together, looking for their friends and =

blockading doors. Everything was panic. There =

had been several false alarms like this over the =

past few days, but when the gas started seeping =

in everyone knew this was the real time. =

Apparently the raid came to get film of =

caribineri dressed up as rioters leaving the =

cops station. =


 At one point while the police were coming down =

the street, I found myself on top of the =

building looking for a friend I had thought was =

there. I could see hundreds of riot cops on the =

front street, and more in the back. In the back =

parking lot they were pulling people out of cars =

who had been sleeping and throwing them agaisnt =

the walls. Then they started attacking the =

locked gate on the back of the school and within =

a few minutes they were filing into one of the =

bottom floors. Some people were running off to =

closets to hide, I ran down to the IMC floor. =


 Soon the cops were in. In the last minutes we =

had taken down the barricades knowing that it =

would make them more agro, and there was no =

stopping them. The cops came, they put us all =

against walls and made us sit lined up. It was =

really tense. Everyone had been hearing the =

rumours. On other floors we could hear loud =

smashes and noise. Screams were coming from out =

on the street. Most of the cops walking on our =

floor had been plain clothes cops who now wore =

helmets, police vests, and batons. Searches =

began in rooms and equipment/film was taken. (I =

later returned to my bag upstairs finding the =

contents scattered all down the hall with my =

film from the riots missing). =


 Things were looking grim until two people =

emereged , arguing with the cops. At first they =

went to push her out but upon seeing her badge, =

they let her in and all left. It turns out that =

she was a member of parliment and had been on =

the first floor when the cops came in. On her =

floor, the first room was completely trashed, =

monitors smashed, hard disks were ripped out of =

all the computers, and papers were scattered. =

But as they reached her room next and found her =

everything changed. They were led out to the =

hall calmly and given water to drink. Finally, =

everything cleared as the cops left the =

building. We were really lucky. =


 Our friends in the old school next door were =

not. Unfortunately the GSF has been really =

strict about limiting who can come into and out =

of their spaces, and the school next door was =

opened to allow people to use computers and hang =

out/rest if they couldn't offer a reason why =

they desereved a pass. After the cops left our =

building, we watched out the windows to see all =

the police surrounding the opposite building and =

searching throughout. Soon the ambulances came. =

Then the stretchers were coming out. People were =

inside our gate and hanging from windows =

screaming 'ASSISINI'. Lawyers and MP's were =

trying to get into the building to be witnesses. =

The police would not let them Media was =

everywhere. =


 Then from the building emerged 6 cops carrying =

what lloked like a black body bag. I don't think =

that I'll ever forget the gut wrenching screams =

and crys I heard all around me when we saw that. =

We were all so full of rage and unable to deal. =

Soon after another similar bag was brought out. =

To this moment, there has been no mention of any =

deaths, but with all the missing people and =

police control, I wonder what eaxtly happened. =


 You've probably seen the results. Finally after =

all the people had been brought out either to =

the hospital or jail everyone flooded in. The =

cops had sent in cleaning teams, but it was =

still a mess. Blood was smeared on walls and the =

floor, the gear of everyone was torn open and =

thrown everwhere. Doors and windows were =

smashed. The computer terminals were lying on =

the ground in pieces. Absolute chaos. It took me =

a full day before I could even go in. =


 hmmmm....that's kind of what happened late =

Saturday night between 1 and 4. =


 The next day was full of more media and people =

flooding in, everyone having left the other =

spaces because of police raids and random =

beatings. It had become clear that police were =

specifically targeting people in black. While =

the cops had attacked everyone alike , =

throughout the demos, they have picked up on the =

'black block divide' among activists and have =

been inducing more fear along that line. =


 A group of twelve people now with me in Milano =

were picked up when they reached the train =

staion here in Milan. They were then brought the =

the police staion and interrogated about 'black =

block' and forced to where every piece of black =

clothing they had, and then photographed. It was =

even to the point where one was forced to where =

his black socks as the only black item he had. =

This was obviously done more to intimidate and =

reduce support for black block tactics than =

anything else. =


 Yesterday was evacuation day. Everyone was =

dissapearing quickly. There was no food around =

at all and peole were scared. We all thought =

that it would be good to stay and help but we =

knew we couldn't stay by ourselves, and the =

media centre was closing down. All the =

foreigners left at the media centre organized =

amongst themselves and we got a train and bus =

together to Milan, where we are no all in =

Leoncavallo Social Centre. =


 When we arrived at the train station there was =

a big rally for us all and a march to the squat. =

Here we are all recouperating and helping each =

other get over the shock of what haapened. Also =

a lot of legal support and further rallies are =

now in the works. =


 ....gotta go...but one last thing is that while =

I have never seen so many wounded people at a =

demo (over 500 in the hospital), the level of =

shock in some people is unbelievable. Some =

people are talking to themselves and spacing =

out. Some are going through some really tough =

times mentally and we seem very unprepared to =

deal with it. It's a wierd feeling though to =

sort trhough all the feelings of rage and trauma =

over what has haapened (and wanting it to just =

go away) and know that it happens to people all =

over the world in non western countries who are =

resisting, and have been resisting for ages.

 brian s


******************************
Struggles in Ireland
http://struggle.ws

International Anarchism
http://struggle.ws/inter.html

Zapatista Index
http://struggle.ws/zapatista.html


                       ********
               The A-Infos News Service
      News about and of interest to anarchists
                       ********
               COMMANDS: lists@ainfos.ca
               REPLIES: a-infos-d@ainfos.ca
               HELP: a-infos-org@ainfos.ca
               WWW: http://www.ainfos.ca
               INFO: http://www.ainfos.ca/org

 To receive a-infos in one language only mail lists@ainfos.ca the message
                unsubscribe a-infos
                subscribe a-infos-X
 where X = en, ca, de, fr, etc. (i.e. the language cod



A-Infos
News